SUMMARY: NFS over WAN

From: Marco Pineda (mcp4@columbia.edu)
Date: Sat Jul 23 1994 - 01:25:17 CDT


Basically most people said it could be done, with a couple saying that I
might be better off ftp'ing the files over. Since it didn't seem to
matter either way I tried NFS first. On one server the patch
installation went fine. On the other, geographically closer, server two
out of eight installations failed. I copied those files locally and
reapplied them successfully.

Thanks to the following:

 dougj@iplab.health.ufl.edu (Doug Jones)
 "C1231 System Administration" <iwagner@smtp.cnsy-ian.navy.mil>
 jmclip@world.std.com (Jim R McLeanLipinski)
 markm@blackadder.dsh.oz.au (Mark Murdoch)
 Mike Rembis 66520 <ebumfr@ebu.ericsson.se>
 Mike Raffety <mike_raffety@il.us.swissbank.com>
 Dan Jiracek <djiracek@fnbc.com>
 djm@navy.millipore.com (Drew Montag)
 epl@Kodak.COM (Gene Loriot (epl@Kodak.COM.))
 john@pendragon.zim.bms.com (John Turner)
 Dan Stromberg - OAC-DCS <strombrg@bingy.acs.uci.edu>
 jlarivee@dpw.com (Jerry Larivee)

Messages follow my .sig.

*************************************************************************
* Be vague... be very vague. | mcp4@columbia.edu *
* "Carpe Cibum" | Marco Pineda *
*************************************************************************

From: dougj@iplab.health.ufl.edu (Doug Jones)
Message-Id: <9407211701.AA16584@iplab.health.ufl.edu>
To: mcp4@columbia.edu
Subject: Re: NFS over WAN for patch?

I have been using NFS over a router just fine. Go ahead and do it.

dougj

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From: "C1231 System Administration" <iwagner@smtp.cnsy-ian.navy.mil>
To: mcp4@columbia.edu
Subject: re: NFS over WAN for patch?
X-Incognito-Sn: 301
X-Incognito-Format: VERSION=1.60e ENCRYPTED=NO

      I've used that method for systems around the world -- just telnet or
rlogin into the remote machine -- ftp back to your system and get the .Z file
off the CD ( be sure to set binary mode ) and then do a normal install on the
remote system --- works well!!

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From: jmclip@world.std.com (Jim R McLeanLipinski)
Message-Id: <199407211833.AA19499@world.std.com>
To: mcp4@columbia.edu
Subject: Re: NFS over WAN for patch?

>
> Hi, I need to do this fairly soon so if people would please give me their
> opinions on this matter I would appreciate it. I need to get some
> patches applied to some remote machines. They are truly remote, i.e. in
> another time zone. We are connected via a WAN so I can get to them. I
> thought I would mount my SunSolve CD and apply the patches but I know
> there is a problem using NFS through a router. My questions is, should I
> even attempt this, seeing as it will be for a relatively short duration,
> or do you think it is completely inadvisable, or undoable. If it is then
> I might try to overnight the CD to the sites.
>
> I hope you can let me know soon, I have to make a decision today. Thanks
> in advance.
>
I have done this over a 56 k DDS circuit with no problems except for taking
up a lot of bandwitdh and slowwing everyone down

--
Jim McLean-Lipinski
jmclip@world.std.com

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From: markm@blackadder.dsh.oz.au (Mark Murdoch) Message-Id: <9407212310.AA13463@blackadder.dsh.oz.au> To: mcp4@columbia.edu Subject: Re: NFS over WAN for patch? X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 829

Marco,

I have successfully applied patches to remote machines on my WAN using NFS through routers and 64K ISDN lines.

I have not done so from the Sunsolve CD but from disk as the patches were l.oaded from tape. I don't think this will make any difference though.

--

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ,-_|\ Mark Murdoch / \ Manager Technical Support E-mail: markm@dshroot.dsh.oz.au \_,-.*/ Defence Service Homes Phone : +61 6 289 6790 v PO Box 21 Woden ACT Australia Fax : +61 6 289 4776 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The first Oracle 7 site in Australia | --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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From: Mike Rembis 66520 <ebumfr@ebu.ericsson.se> Received: from localhost (ebumfr@localhost) by calvin.ebu.ericsson.se (8.6.4/8.6.4) id QAA08968 for mcp4@columbia.edu; Thu, 21 Jul 1994 16:56:21 -0700 Date: Thu, 21 Jul 1994 16:56:21 -0700 Message-Id: <199407212356.QAA08968@calvin.ebu.ericsson.se> To: mcp4@columbia.edu Subject: Re: NFS over WAN for patch? Reply-To: Mike.Rembis@ebu.ericsson.com

I've NFS mounted from some of our servers in Sweden. I'm in California. It works. Slow, though.

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From: Mike Raffety <mike_raffety@il.us.swissbank.com> X-Organization: Swiss Bank Corporation Message-Id: <9407220901.AA11077@trinity.sbcoc.com> To: mcp4@columbia.edu Subject: Re: NFS over WAN for patch?

Why mount the CD-ROM? Just copy the patch file ...

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From: Dan Jiracek <djiracek@fnbc.com> Message-Id: <199407221141.GAA06319@fctcsvr.fnbc.com> To: mcp4@columbia.edu Subject: Re: NFS over WAN for patch?

I know what you mean! I was just considering doing it myself to apply some pates to 1 of our remote sites. I have a 56K link to it and yes I am going to attempt it. I don't think it will crap out, I just don't think you would want to dothis normally. I

even tried mounting over a dialup line (38400) once, but that was just for kicks and I do not have any statistics.

Dan JIrace ,

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From: djm@navy.millipore.com (Drew Montag) Message-Id: <9407221223.AA08244@navy.BioImage> To: mcp4@columbia.edu Subject: Re: NFS over WAN for patch? Content-Length: 1661

Marco,

>>> Hi, I need to do this fairly soon so if people would please give me their >>> opinions on this matter I would appreciate it. I need to get some >>> patches applied to some remote machines. They are truly remote, i.e. in >>> another time zone. We are connected via a WAN so I can get to them. I >>> thought I would mount my SunSolve CD and apply the patches but I know >>> there is a problem using NFS through a router. My questions is, should I >>> even attempt this, seeing as it will be for a relatively short duration, >>> or do you think it is completely inadvisable, or undoable. If it is then >>> I might try to overnight the CD to the sites. >>> >>> I hope you can let me know soon, I have to make a decision today. Thanks >>> in advance.

You're right, there is a problem using NFS through a router, but "ftp" works just fine. Use that to copy the files to the remote systems, then "rlogin" and install the patches.

Good luck,

Drew +----+ +----++-------------------------+----------------------------+ | \ GO / || Drew Montag | djm@bioimage.millipore.com | ++ + \ / + ++| Sr. Soft. Design Engin. | Voice: (313) 930-9900 | | |\ \/ /| | | Bio Image | FAX: (313) 930-0990 | | | \ / | | | 777 E. Eisenhower Pkwy. | Toll Free: (800) 930-0990 | | | \ / | | | Suite 950 | Voice Mail: (800) 221-1975 | ++ ++ \/ ++ ++| Ann Arbor, Michigan | Extension 8000 | | | BLUE | || U.S.A. 48108-3258 | Mailbox #7909 | +----+ +----++-------------------------+----------------------------+

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From: epl@Kodak.COM (Gene Loriot (epl@Kodak.COM.)) Message-Id: <9407221243.AA03694@caps100.Kodak.COM> To: mcp4@columbia.edu Subject: Re: NFS over WAN for patch? X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 1142

Having done this via a VLLAN (Very Louzy LAN) which I think will simulate a WAN, I would advise ftping the the compressed tar file to the remote machine, zcat/tar it, and then installit, remove the patch directlory.

ALSO...I have noted (as in patch 101329-15) that the script is not written correctly, so that nfs mounted patching WILL fail. --

************************************************************************* ************************************************************************* ***************** On a clear DISK you can SEEK forever ****************** ************************************************************************* ************************************************************************* Gene Loriot E-mail: epl@Kodak.COM Eastman Kodak Company Voice: (716) 724-6962 Customer Equipment Services Division Fax: (716) 724-9860 343 State Street Mail Code: 00708 Rochester, New York 14650-0708 U. S. A. ************************************************************************* *************************************************************************

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From: john@pendragon.zim.bms.com (John Turner) Subject: Re: NFS over WAN for patch? To: mcp4@columbia.edu Message-Id: <9407221337.AA11365@pendragon> X-Envelope-To: mcp4@columbia.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

> >Hi, I need to do this fairly soon so if people would please give me their >opinions on this matter I would appreciate it. I need to get some >patches applied to some remote machines. They are truly remote, i.e. in >another time zone. We are connected via a WAN so I can get to them. I >thought I would mount my SunSolve CD and apply the patches but I know >there is a problem using NFS through a router. My questions is, should I >even attempt this, seeing as it will be for a relatively short duration, >or do you think it is completely inadvisable, or undoable. If it is then >I might try to overnight the CD to the sites. > >I hope you can let me know soon, I have to make a decision today. Thanks >in advance. > >************************************************************************* >* Be vague... be very vague. | mcp4@columbia.edu * >* "Carpe Cibum" | Marco Pineda * >************************************************************************* > >

Marco,

This really depends on the speed of your WAN. We've done NFS over 1MB/sec WANS. It's not fast, but it is ok for something like this. I wouldn't go any slower. If NFS is to slow, why not use something like FTP? If you have a WAN connection of any speed, that is probably faster than overnight delivery.

BTW, what problems with NFS over routers are you refering to? We do NFS over routers all the time.

John

-------------------------------------------------------------------------- John Turner Zimmer Inc. Internet: john@zim.bms.com Senior Analyst P.O. Box 708 Telephone: 219-372-4634 Cad/Cam Services Warsaw, IN 46581-0708 FAX: 219-372-4550 --------------------------------------------------------------------------

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From: Dan Stromberg - OAC-DCS <strombrg@bingy.acs.uci.edu> Content-Length: 1527

It can be done, but tends to be pretty slow over long hauls. EG, if you have /net setup as an ftp->NFS gateway, it's almost always quite noticeably slower than (relatively) raw ftp.

You may want to copy the data to a ufs on the far side of your link, and do the patches from there. rsh and gtar, or dump and restore, should do for the copy.

In message <Pine.3.89C.9407180900.A6385-0100000@ciao.cc.columbia.edu>you write:

Dan Stromberg - OAC/DCS strombrg@uci.edu

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From: jlarivee@dpw.com (Jerry Larivee) To: mcp4@columbia.edu Subject: RE: NFS over WAN for patch? Reply-To: jlarivee@dpw.com Date: Fri, 22 Jul 94 11:40:31 EDT Message-Id: <9407221540.1F388C@pcny1123.dpw.com> X-Mailer: SelectMAIL 1.0

The only suggestion that I'ld make is to set your read and write packet size to something like 512 or even 256, I think just about every router uses packet sizes of 512 or greater. By setting your read and write packet size to 512 (actually maybe 450 to account for overhead) you'll get the best possible through-put without risking packet fragmentation.

The biggest problems with NFS over a WAN is that NFS doesn't deal well with packet fragmentation or lost packets. Unfortunately packet lost is not really something you can do much about, you either have a reliable connection or not.

----------------------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Larivee jlarivee@dpw.com System Programmer (212) 450-4836 Davis Polk and Wardwell New York, NY



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